Guantanamo is an offence to freedom and now Bush thinks that suicide after four years of illegal imprisonment is PR…
Sick!
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6 Responses to “Guantanamo ‘propaganda’”
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June 11th, 2006 at 6:02 pm
I think he said the prisioners killing themselves was a PR move by them to further the Jihad.
June 11th, 2006 at 7:43 pm
Yup. Sick man.
He illegally imprisons at least some innocent people and then claims that some of those who are so desperate that they end it are working to further a terrorist ideal.
June 13th, 2006 at 11:47 am
Sorry Gav,
I don’t believe their suicide pact’s main goal was in reaction to being illegally imprisoned. They had also been on hunger strike for ideological purposes before; they weren’t protesting conditions, they were martyrising themselves. When they were force-fed it was claimed their human rights were breached then, too.
It comes back to that whole atheist thing
: you atheists always tend to think there must be some rational reason for people to do things. When it comes to religious nut jobs, of whatever denomination, rationality does not come into it. An atheist in that situation may kill themselves because they find it unbearable and because this life is all there is. A martyr, trained in martyrdom tactics, considers it a privilege to kill themselves in such a situation, and life doesn’t stop there.
I agree that there should be some resolution as to the legal status of the GTMO prisoners, but, to tell you the truth, someone who flies to Pakistan and travels across the border to Afghanistan on 18 September 2001 is probably not going there to learn their Koran verses better.
June 13th, 2006 at 10:52 pm
Are you back!?
I suspect, James, that you’re right about all of that. But the problem is, if you illegally imprison people you not only give credibility to those who call the West evil, you also harm people who have no way of defending themselves….
I have just one question, why did they commit suicide so much later? If my take on this is because of my atheism, why did they not make their ultimate message known the day they were captured, or on 11 September 2002 etc?
Okay, two, how do we know where they were on 18 Sept. 2001 if there’s been no trial and if the US has tortured these people in order to obtain confessions?
June 14th, 2006 at 8:08 am
Yes, I am, have a lot of downtime during my work handover and interregnum.
But the problem is, if you illegally imprison people you not only give credibility to those who call the West evil, you also harm people who have no way of defending themselves….
I agree with you here, but I still think the legality or illegality is still up for debate. A proper POW camp would probably be the way to go, and trial for treason for those British and American Muslims found to have been fighting. One thing I can guarantee you about those who have gone through American Courts-Martial, they are subject to greater due process than most of the countries who are protesting the existence of the camp would have given them.
why did they commit suicide so much later? If my take on this is because of my atheism, why did they not make their ultimate message known the day they were captured, or on 11 September 2002 etc?
For one, if they had hope to kill more infidels upon their release (as a few former Guantanamo detainees have been caught in the process of planning since their release), they had something to look forward to.
Secondly, they had already tried killing themselves with their hunger strike. The timing doesn’t matter so much.
Okay, two, how do we know where they were on 18 Sept. 2001 if there’s been no trial
Sorry, that was a specious reference to the Tipton Three, who “accidentally” ended up in Kandehar a week after Sept. 11.
and if the US has tortured these people in order to obtain confessions?
I don’t believe they were tortured to obtain confessions, unless you consider, for instance, the presence of a woman interrogator torture; I think anything that exploits their superstitions, of which they have many, should be used. But alas, that is considered torture, too. Their own literature says to spread disinformation if captured.
Why is it so much easier to take their statements at face value when they are in custody, but not to do so when they are walking freely? BTW, remember the Koran flushing event? Which didn’t happen? That’s torture to them. In some ways, rumours of torture might actually work as a deterrent to those comfy middle class British kids thinking about channelling Mohammed, themselves.
I’m not saying I like GTMO, and I don’t think it helps at all, but I don’t think it changes many people’s minds about the global jihad. Most are made up about this. Mine was. When this whole mess began, I fully believed in the hypothesis put forth by that BBC programme The Power of Nightmare.
In fact, I would have agreed with you wholeheartedly, until I saw the proof with my own eyes that there are groups well-connected to each other, and obviously well-financed, working together to do nasty things to us. And no matter how we behave we are always going to be targets to them.
June 14th, 2006 at 8:11 am
In fact, as an example of what I used to believe, go here.